well at 29 years old, after a lifelong relationship/belief in/association with a higher power i called god, here i am very close to taking an athiestic or agnostic approach to the rest of my life.
it really hit me the other day although my doubts have been there but i just have been forcing myself to ignore them because i was afraid to give up that religious part of me because its all that i have ever been and i was afraid of the unknown.
but i realized after getting through another one of those weeks from hell that it makes no difference how much i pray or how much i believe.
FLOWER, YOU SAID:
things just are the way they are and sometimes things happen the way they happen. sometimes we can control it and sometimes we cant. sometimes people are to blame and sometimes theres nothing they can do to change things.
BINGO ... that's what most of the board has been saying, I'm glad you agree.
never ending treadmill poster depicting wt life.
.
which way is up?
MAVMAN:
We rejoice in the fact that we have Jehovah's backing and he will provide protection and salvation in unavoidable battle of Armageddon
I've never been a JW, I'm really interested in know how the JW's lay claim to having Jehovah's backing? How were they organized in the mid 1800's, before the Bible Students, and did GOD appear to Charles Russell to let him know that he was the one? Looking at JW history is so hazy on their claim to be the TRUTH. Give me some hard, sold facts...I really am interested.
for once i will try to post a serious topic so here goes.... most of us here have rejected most if not all of the jw teachings.
i (as well as most of you) certainly do not believe that armaggedon will arrive someday in the future and everybody who is not a jw will die and the witnesses that are left will rebuild the earth.. so, the question i have is this: what do you think happens when you die?.
do you go to heaven or hell?
How comforting Elsewhere... if I had know that, I would have checked out years ago.
well at 29 years old, after a lifelong relationship/belief in/association with a higher power i called god, here i am very close to taking an athiestic or agnostic approach to the rest of my life.
it really hit me the other day although my doubts have been there but i just have been forcing myself to ignore them because i was afraid to give up that religious part of me because its all that i have ever been and i was afraid of the unknown.
but i realized after getting through another one of those weeks from hell that it makes no difference how much i pray or how much i believe.
FLOWER:
Conclusion: the bible is a book written by men and is no more holy then the Watchtower. the force that caused mankind to be, whatever it is, is not likely a person.
Well, now that you've come to your final conclusion, BE FREE!!! ...quite torturing yourself with "why this" and "why not that" ...GOD doesn't exist, or if He does, he's not a person, right?... Breath in some fresh air and say "Now that I've got that GOD nonsense out of my mind, let's move forward". And as you move forward, in your freedom, have no grand expectations like you previously did, because if you don't ever expect anything, you won't ever be disappointed.
Now, don't you feel better...there is no, nor ever has been a GOD...things are done randomly and make no sense.. so no ones to blame but yourself for your past life. OUCH.
well at 29 years old, after a lifelong relationship/belief in/association with a higher power i called god, here i am very close to taking an athiestic or agnostic approach to the rest of my life.
it really hit me the other day although my doubts have been there but i just have been forcing myself to ignore them because i was afraid to give up that religious part of me because its all that i have ever been and i was afraid of the unknown.
but i realized after getting through another one of those weeks from hell that it makes no difference how much i pray or how much i believe.
SIXOFNINE:
As far as what I can do for God, I don't see that any human in history has recieved an answer to that. Maybe it's not a valid question?
I think the answer if very clear and simple (IMHO):
Matthew 25:40
Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
never ending treadmill poster depicting wt life.
.
which way is up?
FREDHALL:
Satan,
Stick that fork up your ass!!!
Aren't you being a teensy bit oversensitive to SAINTSATAN's remark. After all, you're the one using the picture of Lucifer with a bad hair day.
for once i will try to post a serious topic so here goes.... most of us here have rejected most if not all of the jw teachings.
i (as well as most of you) certainly do not believe that armaggedon will arrive someday in the future and everybody who is not a jw will die and the witnesses that are left will rebuild the earth.. so, the question i have is this: what do you think happens when you die?.
do you go to heaven or hell?
Saint:[QUOTE]Another thing that you could do, is a search on nde, near death experiences. Try to get some from atheists. Read a few of those. Of course most scientists think those are hallucinations caused by wierd brain chemical changes[/QUOTE
A few years ago I talked with a couple of people who had near-death experiences... they were so interesting that started researching on the internet. There are numberous sites. A few of the stories are a little bizarre, but for the most part they make for something-out of-the-ordinary reads. Re the quote above, scientist do ridicule the notion of life after death, but then again they're scientist and they're trying to physically prove something that's not physical. There are dozens of stories, however, that disprove the scientist claim....experiences where something more was going on besides "mindgames". Also, there are a lot of previously non-believing Doctors who now have changed their opinions after some of their experiences with their patients. I especially like the Doctor that worked with terminally ill children...their stories are facinating because the have no biases. The following is a link with people's personal experiences if anyone's interested, or like SAINT said type into a search engine "near death experiences"
tonight i was leaving my flat with my brother, when a drunk guy from across the road came over shouting that his freinds apartment was on fire.. my brother and my kicked in the door, and went in to the flaming building three times.
we eventually found him slumped over in a sofa.. i thought we were goners because we got lost on the way out, the smoke had by this time filled the room.. my brother and me dragged him out the door when his collection of half finished whisky bottles and gas lighterc refills exploded.. the only casualty was us with smoke inhalation, and my brothers car keys which fell out of his pocket in the rush.. look in the lisburn star on fridays for my smokey face.
a good day .. josephus
A hugh slap on the back Josephus....You Are The Bravest Link!!!
well at 29 years old, after a lifelong relationship/belief in/association with a higher power i called god, here i am very close to taking an athiestic or agnostic approach to the rest of my life.
it really hit me the other day although my doubts have been there but i just have been forcing myself to ignore them because i was afraid to give up that religious part of me because its all that i have ever been and i was afraid of the unknown.
but i realized after getting through another one of those weeks from hell that it makes no difference how much i pray or how much i believe.
BORGFREE:
I could give you many stories like the one Double Edge just gave, but, as I suspected, such stories are not well received.
You've said a mouthful..that is EXACTLY why I thought twice about relaying my experience. I've only told a couple of people about that and it happened years ago. I won't even go into the deeper experiences...what's the point.
Like every one that walks this earth we have to take life as it is - the good, the bad and the ugly. We're here, it's tough, get use to it. But there are opportunities for those that have the eyes to see and the ears to hear.
I know, I know, I know....I've prayed hundreds of times throughout the years and have been frustrated but the seemingly uncareing attitude of Someone ignoring me. I've yelled, screamed, cried myself to sleep trying to get through on a two-way call to Heaven. I've had people die at my feet when I cried out for God to intervene, knowing that he had answered my prayers before but that this time he was silent. I've lost my way, my friends, my faith, my love. ... like everyone else....I've LOST...and I've hated and I've cursed and at 20-years old I went out to the desert to blow my brains out...but didn't.
I've also GAINED, big time... because like everyone else, I've muddle through life taking a step at a time, trying to figure the whole thing out. No, I don't have all the answers, but I have a hell of a lot of good solid clues and some wonderous experiences which I realize now that only I can appreciate - for they mean very little to those who haven't gone through them - and they're just fodder for others to ridicule. But it doesn't matter, because those precious few times that the "heavens were opened" are enough to sustain me the majority of this life which can be mean and miserable and full of doubt.
through one of the respopnses to old hippie's strange noise thread, a thought occurred to me.
do atheists or agnostics believe in ghosts?
and if you do, what do you think they are?
XANDER: You're reading way too much into my reply.
So, you are saying the overriding goal of a demon is to make good christians into atheists? (Since 'their work is already done with them')I'm not saying any such thing. You said why do they only attack believers who claim God's protection. You're assuming that it's only the 'believers' who have seen ghosts, demons, or whatever...that's not the case. A lot of 'non-believers' have had similar experiences..I don't think they're that picky. I think a lot of what you see on TV where these Evangelists are casting out demons are people wanting their 15 minutes of fame (yeah right, like that makes them famous)... they have highly evolved imaginations. But I do think that along with unseen "positive" energy, forces, (whatever) there are unseen "negative" forces. No, I don't think it's the demons job to make atheist out of christians (they might scare the begebbers out of them though).
Again with the logic test:
If there is no GOD (positive force) than there are no demons (negative force), so the point is moot. however,
If there is a GOD (positive) then then possiblity of demons (negative) is real. It seems that their job is to counter the positive. My statement regarding not attacking atheists means what's the point...there's nothing to counter. What their job is, how they manifest themselves can probably be answered only by those who have had "real" experiences with them.
Wouldn't it be better to just leave them alone? I mean, if they don't ever see any evidence of supernatural beings, won't they start questioning their beliefs? But, if the demons kept haunting them, it just reinforces their christian teachings.
That would seem to be true if you assumed that their only mission would be to thwart a belief in GOD. Therefore, the little tricksters must have multi-purposes.
If, on the other hand, demons are just generally evil and enjoy torturing humans, you'd think the 'helpless' atheists would all be dead by now at demon hands, since they have no divine protection.First of all, I do think demons are just generally evil...and pathetic. I think they're mad as hell (excuse the pun) all of the time. And I don't think humans, atheists or believers are helpless - I think we're hands over fist infinitly more powerful because we do have a God-given body (so to speak)and that makes them mad...I just think some of them know how to play off our imaginations and fear..and when that happens, we GIVE them the power.
As for me...except for answering this post, I don't give any thoughts to them or the time of day.
